Star Trek vs Star Wars (back again)

For things not related directly to ApeZone games. Discuss, debate, but do it in good taste.

Who would win Star Trek or Star Wars?

Star Wars
5
45%
Star Trek
5
45%
I can't read.
1
9%
 
Total votes : 11

Star Trek vs Star Wars (back again)

Postby Humans shall rule the gal » Sun Oct 17, 2004 7:17 pm

Alright before you post on this topic bring something new to it. Read through the OLD ST v SW topic on page 2 of the General Discussion page.

Alright on to my new stuff.

For Star Wars: As soon as Star Trek ship's shields go down the mobile Ion Cannons on any Frigate-SSD type ship will fire on the Trek ship. Ion cannons fry circuitry, computers, and wipe memory on all systems. Star Trek ships might have Life Support failure from an Ion Cannon hit or 2. Of course there is the Warp Core Breach (OMG) that is classic Trek. If a Trek ship got ion-cannoned it would prolly die in a big blast.

For Star Trek: Warp Core Breaches, would ANY Star Wars ship survive a proximity Warp Core blast? I mean, c'mon, look at what it did to the Enterprise D in Generations. Ai yiyi.

Tactics to capitilize on stuff: Star Wars could ion-cannon a ship in the center of a Star Trek fleet and watch the ship blow all ships in the area to kingdom come. Especially since each ship blowing up would in turn have a warp core breach and add to the conflagration. Star Trek could self-destruct a mobile warp core beside a SSD and watch it go boom. Fairly even.

Now for the (supposed) tactic of FTL strafing of a Wars ship by, say, the Enterprise. The Enterprise could not use phasers since phasers don't work at warp. Want to know why? They rely on lightspeed to hit a target, when in FTL the phasers would hit their own ship. Only Photon Torps could be used and since they are the same as Proton Torps a Trek ship would never penetrate a capital (IE Frigate and higher 'vettes are just large fighters basically) ship's shields. Also if you look in Return of the Jedi the Death Star fired on a Calamari Cruiser not a Corellian Corvette, look at it in DVD edition under 4X magnification (yes I'm a nerd).

Alright now, I'm a person who thinks Star Wars will win no matter what, even discounting the production advantage (already discussed). I have read a lot of Trek and Wars books, watched the movies, and honestly feel Wars would win. Read Star Trek Technical Manual, if you want a good feel for the Federation's Galaxy Class ship.

Anywho I hope I gave people new life in an old topic that should always be around (in my opinion)
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Postby CHOAM » Thu Oct 21, 2004 10:46 pm

Species 8472... enough said
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Is it? Is it really?

Postby Humans shall rule the gal » Sat Oct 23, 2004 4:28 pm

Is that enough said CHOAM? Ion Cannons produce a curious effect on living creatures hit with them (I, Jedi [A book]). It seems to overload the creature's neural net and send them into kinks (literally). Given that I haven't seen 8472 in action, other then to read Star Wars at you I can't say much. :P
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Postby CHOAM » Sun Nov 21, 2004 6:10 am

Okay...

They "Death Starred" a planet with only 9 of their bio ships firing. Less than 20 seconds power up sequence. Each ship is the size equivalent of a fighter and they had atleast hundreds of ships capable of warping through wormholes.
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Interesting

Postby Humans shall rule the gal » Sat Dec 04, 2004 2:41 am

Interesting. However if you refer to the discussion of 8472 in the other thread of this, you'll find that we're dealing only Alpha/Beta/Gamma/Delta quadrants. And 8472 are in another universe entirely. That's not to say 8472 couldn't beat living H-word out of Star Wars, but just that they aren't pertinent to the discussion at hand.

On to more stuff.

There was a point about diseases brought up, that Star Trek had more and was capable of producing as many as needed for war. Ok, granted. But if you look in the Young Jedi Knights (YJK) series, you'll find the Emporer experimented with many diseases. The Emporer was in power only 20 years I think. And yet he came up with over 50 different diseases directed at lots of species, including humans. If the Empire were to fight, biological warfare would be right behind.

You don't even have to look in a kid's book for that. In the X-Wing series, the books dealing with Couresent (however that is spelled), there is much crying made about the Krytos Virus. This virus was engineered in weeks, and yet it took out a lot of the non-human population of Courensent, forcing a planet-wide quarentine. Although it was curable, the specific substance needed is not in Star Trek. Enough said, biological warfare is restored to equalibrium.

No new points about weapons/shield technology.

A point about armour technology. Quantom armor is impenatrable in Star Wars. If, say, a Star Destroyer had that, then a small shield capable only of resisting transporters, something EVIL would be created. Since both sides have agreed that weapons/shields tech is equal, then obviously Star Trek would have a problem.

Even 8472 might have issues with a fleet of Mon Cals with that setup, simply because its theorized in Star Wars that quantom armor can take a SUPERLASER (E.G. Death Star) hit and stay alive. Nonetheless, manuverability would be a problem, and I think our good Star Warsies would steer clear of the universe of 8472s.
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Postby CHOAM » Sat Dec 04, 2004 4:50 am

If you refer to Star Trek Vovager Episode "Unimatrix Zero Part II", the friend of Seven of Nine who's name I forgotten said that he's in the Beta quadrant at the edge of fluidic space, which coincidentally is the type of space the species 8472 came from... might be a coincidence, or it might be that they exists in the beta quadrant, so I don't really know. That plus they can make wormholes. Just something for you to think about.

Though I would like to add that if the death star weapon was just a "Superlaser" or "really big laser" (which it probably isn't), then according to Star Trek The Next Generation, they are pretty much ineffective... Riker was saying as a joke that they should go to "yellow alert" and follow procedures precisely when "threatened" with lasers. And Jean Luc or some other command staff said something to the effect of that lasers cannot penetrate the Enterprise's shield and the alert was pointless.
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Postby Humans shall rule the gal » Sat Dec 04, 2004 7:33 pm

Ok first of all, a little later in NextGen, while Picard is transporting the deaf negotiator, they go to a planet that uses lasers. There, Picard+Riker are extremely worried about the lasers, and demand a cease fire before lowering shields.

Second, your right about the "lasers" in Star Wars. They are actually turbocharged gas or something like that. I can't find my guide to Star Wars Weapons and Technology. In any case, the Death Star can crack a planet through an energy shield. No Star Trek planet has a planetary shield except that "legendary" planet that was sterile because of its cloak.

Thirdly: Even 8472 would have issues with Hyperdrives. A Star Wars ship can cross the galaxy in about a week or less. Think about how quickly the Death Star could come in, SL a planet, and jump out. Or even a fleet of Star Destroyers. They could sterilze a planet and leave before anyone could even respond.
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Postby Humans shall rule the gal » Mon Jan 10, 2005 6:31 pm

Three things today. First: Star Wars weapons work like this...

The (Star Wars "beam weapon") actuator combines high-energy blaster-gas (Tibanna Gas, like, say, from Bespin if you want to turbo-charge the shot) with a large power charge. The "Laser", or, "Particle" weapon then sends the charged gas through a prismatic crystal housing to focus the shot. Static pulse adaptors feed the shot into the emitter nozzle wherein the shot leaves the barrel. Blasters require 18 different parts to function, not including a charge module (to recharge the power pack) and a source of blaster-gas. Gas modules, in the normal smuggler's weapon give 500 shots, with 100 shots/power pack.

Secondly, Alien Races and What to do with those d*amn omnipotent beings/The Force

Now, if your going to bring in 8472 Star Wars will bring in the Ssi-Ruuvi and the Chiss. The Ssi-Ruuvi entechment rig (Read The Truce at Bakura, Timothy Zahn [Zhan?]) can take the life of any person and make it into a battary for a robot. Typically its used to make Ssi-Ruuvi battlebots. With a Jedi in the entechment rig, he can be used to entech subjects in other sectors...ouch (in a second I'll show something to cancel this, if Trekkies want to take it).

Now the Chiss are another race of beings from the Unknown Space. Dedicated Warsies read about how one of their patrol commanders destroyed Outbound Flight, well, this subcommander went on to become the legendary Grand Admiral Thrawn. If he is truly only worthy to be a subcommander with Chiss, think about how good their Admirals must be...

Now, what goes on with Omnipotent Beings and The Force. If Star Wars came from a kooky multiverse (C'mon you stupid Trekkies, read The Q Continuum, by Greg Cox) then neither would be able to affect the other. Q couldn't move Star Wars, and The Force wouldn't exist. 'nuff said (Assuming the Q don't go all cheapy and explode Trek suns...Don't start with me).

Last, a short story (that I thought up in the shower :lol: ) for how the two sides came to meet and be at war.

The New Republic (NR) is flourishing after the Empire's surrender. The Yuuzhan Vong haven't invaded (Yet), and the Ssi-Ruuvi are dealt with. The United Federation of Planets (UFP) is doing fairly well, and riding high after the events of Starfleet Command 3 (a game by Taldren; check out the Gamespot review). NR scientists, going through Imperial Records, stumble upon an extraordinarily well-encrypted file. Bringing in slicers (AKA Hackers) the file is decrypted and gives a cryptic string of coordinates, somewhere in the Galactic Core. Investigating with a task force of 3 Corellian Corvettes, a medical frigate (Nebulan B), a Strike Cruiser, and the Imperial Star Destroyer (Insert NR name, give me a good one and I put it in) is Admiral Ackbar.

Ackbar finds a large Imp battlestation guarding a science station, with corperate ships fighting around it. They scatter like flies from a carcass when Ackbar's fleet moves in. Investigating, Ackbar finds both stations deserted and badly damaged in the recent battles. After furthur findings with his small fleet, it becomes apparent that the science station opens and keeps open wormholes, STEADY wormholes. However, the science station is so badly damaged that it can only open one more wormhole, ever. It can keep the wormhole open for infinity, but can't open another.
After due consideration a wormhole is opened, and a mapping expedition is sent forth, into what is noted is an unknown galaxy.

Captain's Log; Stardate XXXXXX.XX, (give me a pertanent date Trekkies)
The USS Hawkins has recently discovered unknown craft exiting a wormhole. After due consideration I have decided to exit the nebula I've been hiding in and investigate. These craft are small, the largest about the size of the Akira class. A Sovreign should have no issues if it comes to blows.

Captain's Log; Year XXXXXX.XX ABY, (give me a date Warsies)
We have exited the wormhole and are charting hyperspace routes. We cannot be sure of any but some preparation is better then none. We have picked up a large amount of what is, apparently, Holonet signaling (remember Trekkies, holonet=no-lag transmissions in Wars universe) going on, and are confident the galaxy we have entered shouldn't be too...distrusting.

As the Hawkins approaches, the mapping expedition raises shields and powers up weapons, though not launching fighters. The ships hail each other and exchange information at a safe distance. The Hawkins is surprised to hear about beings from another galaxy, but warns them of the fact that they are near the Neutral Zone, with Romulans close by. The Hawkins contacts Starfleet Command for instructions, and is surprised to hear that they should quarentine the intruding craft, pending an investigation of their intentions. The mapping expedition is not too happy to hear about this, and, since they plotted a hyperspace course, jump out without warning on a course for (Planet Name, give me one). The Hawkins plots the course and goes to Maximum Warp to get there ASAP, while warning Starfleet Command. The mapping expedition reaches the planet to find 3 ships there, each looking like a saucer with legs behind it. These ships raise shields and demand that the expedition power down.

The USS Rand (Intrepid Class), the USS Whitney (Excelsior class), and USS Pendleton (Saber Class) greeted the mapping expedition, and demanded that they power down. The USS Hawkins was 5 minutes behind, while the USS Enterprise (Sovreign) was the next expected arrival, in about 3 hours. The mapping expedition refused, and began scanning the whole system, as well as the craft. The captains conferred, then agreed to disable one of the ships, then destroy the rest. The mapping expedition was utterly annihilated (the disabled one self-destructed), but took the Whitney, and the Pendleton, and an innocent Ferengi craft, that started salvaging a hulk, with them. Before they died they got off a message capsule that told of what had happened...

The public outcry at this was for revenge, and the Republic had to oblige. After the Yuuzhan Vong attack was redirected into the wormhole (love those Jedi Mind Tricks), a large republic fleet gathered, waited 3 months, then went through with the intention of wrecking havoc on the UFP, and anyone else who got in the way. :twisted:

Who knows what happened to the Yuuzan Vong, I'm willing to just let them and an unlucky Borg attack force kill each other.

Borg...Cyborg...anyone thinking what I'm thinking? Alternate Earth develops, goes to the Way of the Hive, and some independance-liking people just leave and colonize the Now-Earth?

Need the story be revised? Need to argue with me? DO SO! I want arguement, its healthy.

(EDIT) Aw crud. I missed 1/2 an hour of SG-1 writing this. Anyone want a SG-1 vs something else thread?
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Postby Celestrialnaut » Mon Jan 24, 2005 3:50 pm

There are a lot of sites for this, including www.stardestroyer.net
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Postby Insayn » Wed Jan 26, 2005 7:48 pm

Wow, Celestrial, I was on that site for hours. I had no idea scope which star wars would dominate star trek. I mean star treks shields, weapons, drives- everything is on a scale of millions of times less powerful than star wars tech. There is no arguement to speak of unless you simply dont know the facts and only perfer one over the other simply because(i prefered starwars because Darth vader is just so cool and jedi knights have such awesome abilities).
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